Commitment To The Unverifiable.

1howhardisthatCOLCP

This topic had to come from my good friend who intends partnering me in an ashram some time in the future. While he will be the Guru, I will be the gate collection manager.

There are only two commitments that come to my mind that people commit to without verification.  One is of course God and the other is the after life.  To the best of my knowledge, no one has ever seen God nor has come back to share experiences of hell or heaven.  But these two are the commitments that are universal and have caused more problems for mankind than any other ever.

Calvin and Hobbs

This topic was suggested by The Old Fossil Conrad for the weekly Friday Loose Bloggers Consortium where currently six of us write on the same topic every Friday.  I hope that you enjoyed my contribution to that effort.  The five other bloggers who write regularly are, in alphabetical order,  AshokgaelikaaMaxi, and Shackman and The Old Fossil. Do drop in on their blogs and see what their take is on this week’s topic. Since some of them may post late, or not at all this week, do give some allowance for that too!

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34 Responses to Commitment To The Unverifiable.

  1. You once quoted Jung’s, “I don’t think, I know.” Presumably that’s also commitment to the unverifiable. Do you think that attitude causes trouble?
    Cheerful Monk recently posted..Yay, Old Folks!

    • Knowing is to have experienced. In other words it has been verified for the individual concerned. There is no more ambiguity and no need to commit or not to the experience. To explain that is why I added the Calvin and Hobbs cartoon strip.

    • A lot of people know God exists because of their experiences. So it’s no difference than your knowing.
      Cheerful Monk recently posted..Yay, CBC!

      • Agreed. I never said otherwise.

        • So what was the point of saying “To the best of my knowledge, no one has ever seen God”?
          Cheerful Monk recently posted..Crazy Systems

        • Of course, I did notice that. That implies you need to see God to verify that He/She/It exists.
          Cheerful Monk recently posted..Quarantine?

          • Now we are beginning to go in circles. I disagree. You need to know the truth not see God. This is often done by negating what is not than what is. Praatar-Bhajaami Manasaa Vacasaam-Agamyam
            Vaaco Vibhaanti Nikhilaa Yad-Anugrahenna |
            Yan-Neti-Neti-Vacanair-Nigamaa Avocam_
            s-Tam Deva-Devam-Ajam-Acyutam-Aahur-Agryam ||2||
            Meaning:
            2.1: In the Early Morning I worship That, Which is beyond the Mind and the Speech,
            2.2: (And) By Whose Grace all Speech shine,
            2.3: Who is expressed in the scriptures by statement “Neti Neti”, since He cannot be adequately expressed by Words,
            2.4: Who is called the God of the Gods, Unborn, Infallible (i.e. Imperishable) and Foremost (i.e. Primordial).

        • So why even talk about seeing God? Most religious people “know” God and don’t see. Your use of the term see muddies the waters.

          Also your statement, “But these two are the commitments that are universal and have caused more problems for mankind than any other ever.” No, belief in God and the afterlife is not universal. Hitler believed Aryans were the master race and Jews and Poles, etc. were vermin. God had nothing to do with that. And Communism in Russia killed millions of people, and God didn’t enter into the picture there.
          Cheerful Monk recently posted..Quarantine?

          • Frankly, I would rather not. I have no intentions of muddying any waters. I would rather not debate on matters religious or spiritual as they will lead us nowhere. The topic was for the LBC and there we are more light hearted and banter more than get into metaphysical discussions.

          • India teaches us about “ The Four Principles of Spirituality ”. And I am very much an Indian.

            The First Principle states:
            “Whomsoever you encounter is the right one”
            This means that no one comes into our life by chance. Everyone who is around us, anyone with whom we interact, represents something, whether to teach us something or to help us improve a current situation.
            The Second Principle states:
            “Whatever happened is the only thing that could have happened”
            Nothing, absolutely nothing of that which we experienced could have been any other way. Not even in the least important detail. There is no “If only I had done that differently…, then it would have been different…”. No. What happened is the only thing that could have taken place and must have taken place for us to learn our lesson in order to move forward. Every single situation in life, which we encounter, is absolutely perfect, even when it defies our understanding and our ego.
            The Third Principle states:
            “Each moment in which something begins is the right moment”
            Everything begins at exactly the right moment, neither earlier nor later. When we are ready for it, for that something new in our life, it is there, ready to begin.
            This is the Fourth Principle, the final one:
            “What is over, is over”
            It is that simple. When something in our life ends, it helps our evolution. That is why, enriched by the recent experience, it is better to let go and move on.
            I think it is no coincidence that you are here reading this.
            If these words strike a chord, it’s because you meet the requirements and understand that not one single snowflake falls accidentally in the wrong place!

        • ??? Your last two comments seem to contradict one another, don’t they.
          Cheerful Monk recently posted..Good-bye Tree

        • “The test of a first-rate intelligence is the ability to hold two opposed ideas in mind at the same time and still retain the ability to function.”

          F. Scott Fitzgerald

          Noticing our inconsistencies and resolving them at a higher level is how we challenge our minds and ourselves. In other words, it’s part of the adventure of living for those of us who like to think.
          Cheerful Monk recently posted..Good-bye Tree

    • Don’t forget, my brain is my favorite toy.
      Cheerful Monk recently posted..Good-bye Tree

  2. Ironic isn’t it that the thing meant to give the most comfort is also the primary cause of grief and discomfort in the world? The again maybe not.

  3. Big John says:

    “have caused more problems for mankind than any other ever”. I’m not so sure about the after life; but that God has plenty to answer for !
    Big John recently posted..My holy ‘mumbo-jumbo’ moment.

  4. maxi says:

    When I saw this topic I thought, “What the hey?” Now that I have read your post it makes a little sense. Thanks, Rummy.
    blessings ~ maxi
    maxi recently posted..My Kids Would Never Say This

  5. nick says:

    You could also have mentioned psychic experiences. People are convinced they foretold the future or sensed some awful disaster or read someone’s mind, but of course this is also unverifiable unless you can see into the mind of the person making the claims.
    nick recently posted..Rush to judgment

  6. tammyj says:

    sigh….
    i know i do not have the proper respect for academia that i should.
    i know that about myself. it has its place. it’s just not in my place.
    but i LOVE your first cartoon. LOLOL!!! i love it!
    and i laughed also at recognition in calvin’s words written down.
    but i believe simply… we will survive or we will not.
    and we will not know until we do or do not.
    i just can’t seem to get all worked up about it. LOLOL.
    i’m a happy buddhist with his belongings in a pack on his back i guess.
    no one will ever ask me to a faculty tea! 😀
    i’m the guy who can’t say om mani padme hum twice in a row correctly!
    tammyj recently posted..white messenger

    • You are in elite company. “I have been blessed to have had many excellent teachers. The further I get away from school, though, the more I realize that the greatest teachers in my life have come from outside of academia.”
      ~ Brad Thor

      And now you are in the company of the Dalai Lama too!

  7. I know that lots of people will believe stuff that can’t be proven. Lucky for me, I’m not one of those who believes in either of the two things you mentioned here. I do believe in the inherent goodness of people in general, yet everyday it seems the news is trying to find ways to disprove my belief. That’s why I stopped watching the news; I guess we all have delusions we’d rather not have someone else trying to quash.
    Mitch Mitchell recently posted..What’s Your Gullibility Factor?

  8. It’s probably no surprise that I’m familiar with the principles of spirituality, That’s why I was surprised and disappointed you never alluded to them when you were dealing with your father. In the beginning over at stresstopower you said you never had stress because you meditated. Then when you were struggling you talked in terms of why-me-itis rather than looking for the blessing in the situation.

    The miracle is not to walk on water. The miracle is to walk on the green earth in the present moment, to appreciate the peace and beauty that are available now. And that is not a matter of belief. It is a matter of practice.
    —Thich Nhat Hahn

    The reason I’ve studied Psychosynthesis, NLP, the Enneagram, Myers-Briggs, behavior modification, etc. is because I’m interested in how to live these principles in my everyday life. It’s a lot more interesting than just talking about them.
    Cheerful Monk recently posted..Good-bye Tree

    • CM, my father died two years ago and I have dropped that four year period from my psyche. Why are you still carrying it? I am still on my path and have not claimed to have reached Buddhahood. I am very much human and still suffer the odd discomfort due to the vicissitudes that life offers up. I would like to believe that I have retained my sanity, for what it is worth and have continued to live and be of some use to a few people in my life thanks to my being on the path. I am comfortable in my skin. Please do not think that I am super human. I am not and do not claim to be one.

      If by studying all those nice things you have learnt to live a happy and fulfilling life, I am very happy for you. I hope that you will continue to live like that. I just like to live everyday as it comes up and if some days I have some why-me-itis, so be it. That is also part of my existence.

      Believe me, I am living a very comfortable and comparable to a lot of other people that I know, a happy and contented life. The miracle is to live one day at a time and be wiser by hindsight and laugh at those moments that seemed endless when they happened.

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